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Mike_Lancelot
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Posted: Wed Jul 23, 2008 2:38 pm Post subject: Lectures from "professor" Mike
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Q: there is a player who i battle with frequently, and the stats NEVER change. leadership bonus, fort. bonus, weaponry. even after i buy lots of things to change it, it never changes. thoughts?
That's not unusual at mid to end stages of the round. If both players have max general and the same leadership techs, then there are only 3 variables left to determine that bonus: number of techs 5% (assuming the Parliament never changes weapons import issue, it's been the same for 6 rounds at least), bigger palace 10% and smaller pop another 5%*.
As for the other bonuses: fortification is given in steps of 10% and the difference between the rams vs walls amounts that determines those steps is quite sizeable. And while weaponry is capped at 10%, you can be lots ahead or behind and still keep getting the same (+/-) 10%.
* 20%, if your population is "twice smaller"
Last edited by Mike_Lancelot on Thu Jul 24, 2008 1:21 am; edited 2 times in total
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Mike_Lancelot
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Posted: Wed Jul 23, 2008 2:48 pm Post subject:
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Q: What is the average that people will attack so they will get max gold?
Sir_Cala wrote:
Usually when someone shows 20,000 gold that is a good reference.
However if you attack a player and your about equal strenght in score you would have to attack them when they have 35,000+ to get the 10,000 gold. This does not apply to inactives with a score of 2 or less or those who are less than 1/3 your score.
I think Sir_Cala means about equal strength in your att vs their def... score has (in principle) nothing to do with gold gain when you are attacking players above 1/3rd of your score.
Also the part about needing the target to hold 35K instead of 20K to get full 10K as loot is only a speculation (albeit that seems to be consistent with observed reality)... Chris says he has not programmed anything like that...Quote:
Maybe... but if so, it must be caused by a black hole or supernova explosion in a near galaxy since I'm sure I haven't coded anything like that
Jantar wrote:
I have also noticed that even when attacking players with a higher score I often only get 1/3 of their gold. So there is definately something in the programming causing it.
I think that Chris meant that there is no relation between full/partial gold gain and the amount of gold the target is holding (other than those mentioned in
lordsgame.com/help.php?a=advanced ). The diminished gold gain you are experiencing is due to your att vs their def being very close after the bonuses and random factor are applied...getting less than 10K when it should be possible is an indication that you are taking a risk of losing if you keep attacking that person (ceteris paribus).
Sir_Cala wrote:
Mike wrote:
albeit that seems to be consistent with observed reality
I definatly agree with this statement
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Mike_Lancelot
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Posted: Wed Jul 23, 2008 5:06 pm Post subject:
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Q: How can i increase my population? and I keep losing when i attack!
Get the pop techs and the over crowding techs... join the gift ring, if you are active daily. Ask about gift rings in your factionbox. Pick up pop laws whenever available.
To avoid losing battles, pick opponents that don't have much bigger pop or score than you. If they don't have + or * after their name then it might be worth a shot to see if you can win even if they have bigger pop (if they have stopped playing they might have much less troops than pop). Also, train your military, troops experience (TE) is the most efficient way to get stronger. How are your bonuses when attacking? To get better leadership, train your general, for better fortification, buy rams and for weaponry, get blacksmiths
in reply mr X wrote:
Attack: 156,917
Defence: 95,844
Troops experience: 122
Barracks bonus: +12%
This is my army!
For the last 5 times I lose when I attack. I get little + bonuses with everything except fortification.
First, get your barracks bonus to 100%, that will drastically increase your army strenght. Otherwise you just have too little TE... use all your gold from taxes and loot to get your TE to at least 300, preferably 500. Attack down just above 1/3rd of your score if necessary for awhile to get the gold to boost TE, no sense in losing, better to attack down, when you get your TE to 170-200, try attacking up again.
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MNICY
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Posted: Wed Jul 23, 2008 7:32 pm Post subject:
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What do you do when darkdude gets angry you stickied your own thread?
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""Not much Miketivity here, lol....""-Mike_Lancelot
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General Arkon
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Posted: Wed Jul 23, 2008 10:30 pm Post subject:
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I see it as a nice question and answer thread that would be worthy of a sticky in my book. If mike hadn't of stickyed it then I probably would've.
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Mike_Lancelot
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Posted: Thu Jul 24, 2008 1:01 am Post subject:
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The top dog strategy is the winner in the current environment, proved by the wins of WreakHavoc (round 10) and Biscuit (round 11) in the main game and by others (including me) in other lords versions (I even managed to win one game from the top with the old version where that should be impossible
However there can only be so many = very few top dogs, so most players need to try alternative strategies. The old, stay low - attack up, is still a very efficient strategy. Even better is the Heitah-style of high palace attacking up. Then you don't try to stay very low, just low enough to have a few beatable targets ahead of you (lots of TE, decent ram count (1-2K) and maxed general are needed , so you get the better glory with the good troubadours chance and economic benefits of high palace size.
So you want to stay low and still try to get as much glory as possible. Because TE is essential to battle success, your best options to pace your progress in score are in palace and techs. Since the economic and glory effects of palaces are so important in current environment, techs should be taken gradually, just taking those you ABSOLUTELY need.
That's my strat, low techs...
last round it gave me 8th place even though I was the primary target of several tough Dragon players and had hundreds of turns less than many players both above and below me
So there are many possibilities and not all are suitable for all players, each palter needs to find out the style best for him/her... ask and get helped
Everyone's final goal is maximizing the score formula, in the end it is reduced to getting the right palace/TE ratio (because you get all the techs and as much glory as you can). You get either one more palace or as much TE you can get with that gold, depending on which gives more score... ideally you plan this ahead, so that both of those options yield pretty much the same amount. I usually go too high on TE if compared to optimum, but high TE gives battle success benefits that are difficult to weight exactly
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Mike_Lancelot
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Posted: Thu Jul 24, 2008 1:07 am Post subject:
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MNICY wrote:
What do you do when darkdude gets angry you stickied your own thread?
I banzorz his sorry behind... jk
I behave in his forum
www.kunlizhan.com/ , so he better return the courtesy in "MINE"
I am being extra careful with him coz his profile sez:
Quote:
Occupation: Assasin
Interests: Killing noobs
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Mike_Lancelot
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Posted: Thu Jul 24, 2008 1:24 am Post subject:
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Mike_Lancelot wrote:
Sir_Cala wrote:
Usually when someone shows 20,000 gold that is a good reference.
However if you attack a player and your about equal strenght you would have to attack them when they have 35,000+ to get the 10,000 gold.
The part about needing the target to hold 35K instead of 20K to get full 10K as loot is only a speculation (albeit that seems to be consistent with observed reality)...
Some old evidence of a possible pattern (my so called observed reality):
Dracolot 23 seconds ago 10000 +4
Dracolot 26 seconds ago 0 at 29,984 gold
Dracolot 33 seconds ago 5433 +4 suddenly at 35k
Dracolot 36 seconds ago 10000 +4
Dracolot 39 seconds ago 10000 +4
Dracolot 42 seconds ago 10000 +4
Jobu 19 seconds ago 8328 +4 at 29,945
Jobu 23 seconds ago 10000 +4
Jobu 26 seconds ago 10000 +4
Jobu 30 seconds ago 10000 +4
Jobu 35 seconds ago 10000 +4
Jobu 38 seconds ago 10000 +4
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Mike_Lancelot
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Posted: Thu Jul 24, 2008 2:26 am Post subject:
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Heitah, a legendary Elven Lords player wrote:
Population (the ins and outs)
3 gifts = 1 population
First off, 3 gifts per day, you can pull this off nearly every day. Join the gift ring when available. Until then make gift trades.
10 gifts = 2nd population
Technologies = MANY population
There is a +2 tech without any universities! Improved Harvesting. Pick this up the day you start.
Food storage also gives +2 population and should be bought ASAP.
Migration = +30 population at uni6, Royal reinforcements = +20 pop at uni9.
Later on when you have reached 60 population, you will need crowd control.
Buy overcrowding techs at 60, 90 and 120 pop.*
Bottom line, population is extremely important, for every 10 population you get 1 mill = lots of tax money.
Not to mention the relation of your army size and army strenght.
*If you don't get the 3rd one by 130ish, you might as well wait until get to 240 pop (you get -1 at 150 even with all 3)
(Minor edits and updates by me)
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Mike_Lancelot
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Posted: Fri Aug 08, 2008 9:16 pm Post subject:
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Code:
Q: If you buy Hidden treasure tech early in the game you can buy it for less than 10k, if you buy it late in the game it costs much more, well over 200k. Since it is only worth 10k it makes more sense to buy it when it is cheap, doesn't it?
If one gets all the techs (like all players in top200 do), the timing of the purchase of the Hidden treasure tech does not make a difference in your total amount of gold spent to get all them techs. So you either get it early to accelerate your other purchases or save it for later to keep your score lower... a strategy decision
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Mike_Lancelot
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Posted: Fri Aug 08, 2008 11:24 pm Post subject:
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Q: What is the best strategy in the beginning?
I really like swithing between all att/all def early when there is not so much troops... cheap and effective. TE is the most cost effective way to get powerful. Investing in walls seems to pay off, too...but I usually quit getting them pretty soon after the first few days. Getting enough rams is a must. And one should never neglect his general.
I always go for the battle techs first, the mix depends on chosen strategy, full att, full def, balanced, or switching... I usually favour good attack. Chainmail is a killer tech. Some other top players like Sir Cala (and Heitah, who was a champ, but quit) opt for getting the tax techs to benefit from the tax hike of the beginning... not a bad idea if you are logged in at most ticks.
The usual strategy of getting the pop rate to +6 ASAP is a no brainer and so is the race to the Migration, first players to get there get to have a field day for a while (and their early advantage has a tendency to strenghen). One strategy I like and has worked great for me (and against me) is to be a little behind in pop race and benefit from the tech Adv. of Maneuverability ...coupled with well above average TE, of course
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Mike_Lancelot
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Posted: Tue Aug 12, 2008 10:19 pm Post subject:
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Quote:
I'm just starting out, is there a rule of thumb for how many walls and rams I should have?
In your specific case, as a new player starting in the late part of the round, you might as well forget about walls (and anything else defensive, units, techs), coz there is no way to build a defense that will hold if someone with much bigger pop decides to attack you. And they will unless you keep the amount of gold you're showing down. Spend or bank between attacks.
So go all attack, get a 102 rams and buy some levels of general and lots of TE (troops experience, train your troops), stay clear of opponents that give you more than -20% on Fort.bonus. Remember to keep barracks at 100%. I would also forget about blacksmiths and weaponry if I were you, many people are so high in these that you'll probably just waste gold and wind up with getting -10% in that anyway, more TE is the answer to that, too. If you must try blacksmiths, don't get more than 10, 20 tops.
At first attack the inactives with score 2 to get going. Collect 500K or a few million gold before starting to buy anything that raises score, if you already haven't. When you start attacking players higher up, avoid those with much more pop than you, unless they have no + or * after their name, then they might have quit playing and have much less troops than their pop would allow.
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Mike_Lancelot
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Posted: Wed Aug 13, 2008 12:01 am Post subject:
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Formula to calculate Palace size from Taxes
This is the direct formula to get the palace size:
(N-1)*50= palace size,
where N is (Tax-constant)/POP/taxbase,
where constant is 600+(mills*100).
and taxbase = 2+techs
The techs:
Tax office: +2 gold production per population.
Taxation: +1 gold production per population.
Tax collector: +2 gold production per population.
Sales tax: +2 gold production per population (from Economy specialisation)
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Mike_Lancelot
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Posted: Fri Aug 15, 2008 9:58 am Post subject:
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Attack directions, basic options
Heitah style: Attack only up (hunting in the 1st week or 2 excluded), mid palace size
WreakHavoc style: Get loads of palace, attack down at just above 1/3rd of your score
Sir_Cala style: Keep palace low and attack up for the first half of the round, then buy palaces to around 50-60 and start attacking down for troubadours effect
Mike style, get to mid palace ASAP, attack down for the 1st half of the round, then get some more palaces and start attacking up for valuable free TE and +12s (you can always resort to attacking down for awhile to buy more TE if you get battle troubles)
(Styles named after Legendary Elven Lords who have either invented them or perfected them to the state of an art )
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General note: what ever style you choose or if you invent your own mix, NEVER neglect your TE
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Sir_Cala
Joined: 26 Feb 2007
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Posted: Sat Aug 16, 2008 7:17 pm Post subject:
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*Sir_Cala's style changes round to round based on time and location constraints.
Rounds 11 and 12 out of town when rounds started and ended.
Most likely will be out of town for the next one (13) as well.
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